Podcast Episode 21 – Doug Melvin Can Manage my Portfolio | Disciples of Uecker

Disciples of Uecker

We'd like to go to the Playoffs, that would be cool.

Nicholas Zettel & Vineet Barot discuss Managerial Moves and preview the series with the Diamondbacks.



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  1. Jason says: June 16, 2014

    To clarify the rules on options, for three seasons a team can send down a player as many times as they want. After accruing three years of major league service time, a player has the right to refuse an option.

    Marco Estrada has 4.03yrs of service time, so he has the right to refuse if the Brewers optioned him.

    • Nicholas Zettel says: June 16, 2014

      This is true w/ service time, but it’s also true w/ the 40-man — Estrada would also have to pass through waivers since he’s been on a 40-man for more than a handful of seasons.

      I believe that as soon as a player hits a 40-man roster, his option seasons begin.

    • Vin B says: June 16, 2014

      Very confusing stuff. From what I’ve read around the interwebs:

      1) Players only get 3 option years which Estrada has used up.
      2) If the player has an option year left BUT has played for 5 years in ML already, he can be optioned after being on waivers. A player has never been claimed off such waivers per gentleman’s agreement (ala Stephen Drew)

      So it seems like Estrada cannot be optioned with or without permission. Though, again, this is confusing enough where I could be dead wrong.

      • Jason says: June 16, 2014

        As mentioned before, options are very confusing, but I think you are conflating two different types of options. One is option is the 4th year option for someone who has 5years or less of professional experience (Arizona Rookie League, Dominican League and other leagues of 90 days or less do not count) -Cody Scarpetta is a recent Brewers example- and the rules for optioning a player with the veteran’s right of refusal. If a veteran accepts it is just like using an option. If he refuses the team must keep him on the major league roster or waive him.

        • Nicholas Zettel says: June 17, 2014

          Indeed, Jason, this is one of the types of options we were discussing. This type of option is rare — I am not sure that Estrada would be eligible after three consecutive seasons on an MLB roster.

      • Vin B says: June 16, 2014

        I believe you’re referring to a rehab assignment. That’s the only case where a veterans consent is required (ex. Ramirez recently).

      • Vin B says: June 16, 2014

        I believe you’re referring to a rehab assignment. That’s the only case where a veterans consent is required (ex. Ramirez recently).

        For option assignments, players have no say.

        • Jason says: June 17, 2014

          Relevant paragraph:
          Also important to remember is that a player with at least five years of major league service (MLS) can refuse any assignment to the minor leagues, including an optional assignment. These situations are rare, as a player with five years of MLS is unlikely to still have an option remaining, but the Newberg Report’s Jamey Newberg astutely found one in Tim Crabtree in 2000

  2. Josh says: June 16, 2014

    This isn’t complicated about Wang Nick and Vineet. He can be on the 60 day DL starting June 29th and we can keep him. No trade, no offering back. He is then out of the picture and can get in a training program the rest of the year. That opens up several options for the bullpen. Estrada needs to be in the bullpen. Time for Nelson to add a spark.

    • Vin B says: June 16, 2014

      I’ve expressed my concerns in earlier episodes about intentionally DL-ing someone. I understand that strategically it’s a good move but you are basically lying. Especially with the limited usage where “exhaustion” or “dead arm” would definitely be seen as contrived.

      The cubs lost their rule 5 pick in 2013 for doing the same. http://www.bleachernation.com/2013/12/05/cubs-lose-2013-rule-5-draft-pick-to-phillies-because-of-lendy-castillo-shenanigans/

      If the Pirates file a grievance and ask for more than an extra rule 5 pick in return (the way the phillies did as the link shows), the Brewers could be in some trouble.

      • dbug says: June 16, 2014

        Agreed that it is a shady strategy to come up with a convenient phantom injury for Wang. On the other hand, losing a rule 5 draft picks is a pretty weak penalty. Perhaps the prospect of losing Wang for nothing after June 29th is enough to make the Pirates consider taking a player in exchange for Wang.

      • Vin B says: June 18, 2014

        I was initially intrigued by the game of chicken that might take place between Brewers & Pirates over Wang. The longer the Brewers wait, the more leverage they have over the Pirates in getting something in return.

        But it doesn’t seem like the Pirates are interested at all. When I did the Pirates review, the author of “Three rivers blog” (Cory W.) basically responded with “Who?” when asked about Wang.

        We have to remember that while he slots in at roughly #10 prospect or so for the Brewers, the Pirates have a much stronger farm system and thus a pitcher like Wang is not as high of a priority. If it makes the Brewers roster construction tougher, the Pirates may be OK with losing him.

        To expand on my stance on the fake DL, how is it any different from using PED’s or any other form of cheating?

        • dbug says: June 19, 2014

          Good point. It’s not really any different to me, but for some reason PEDs inspire outrage while bending DL rules are just consider clever maneuvering. Seems like the punishments don’t really match the crimes.


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